From a New York Red Bulls perspective, the Hudson River Derby has represented their chance to establish their dominance in the New York soccer market. While strong performances littered the early history of the derby, it has been NYCFC who have gained a foothold in recent years.
We spoke with someone who has been around since the beginning and before in this space: Mark Fishkin, host of the Seeing Red podcast and a unique voice who has seen every era of Metrostars/Red Bulls.
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AJM Sports: Let’s go back to the beginning. What were your feelings when you heard, officially, not the Cosmos, but another MLS team in the New York market?
Mark Fishkin: “I was really of two minds. I know that all the great soccer cities of the world have multiple clubs. At the time, Red Bull Arena had opened, the team was generally playing well. Every other story was if they could sell out the stadium, can they sell it out consistently.
“The New York market is the biggest market in the country by far, it is twice as large as LA. I don’t think people really think about that when they think about the size of the market. On the one hand, I thought it was interesting. The league for years struggled with Metro and Red Bull ownership not really getting it right in terms of players being brought in, the efforts to gain a foothold in the marketing place. Obviously building their own stadium was a huge marker that went down.
“So I don’t disagree that having as second team in New York makes a ton of sense. The market is literally big enough for two teams.”
AJM Sports FC: While I argue that rivalries with DC United and New England still matter, it’s undeniable that the Hudson River Derby has been a huge success over something like the Atlantic Cup.
Mark Fishkin: “Let’s be clear. DC has been mostly bad throughout that period. It’s been a quieter experience. I don’t get the sense that they are as meaningful to Washington DC as they were during the first few years of the league 30 years ago when they won three of the first four MLS Cups.
AJM Sports FC: When you saw that City Football Group and the Manchester City colors were chosen, remember that Red Bull was considered this extension of a marketing campaign, so for the kit release to be the exact same as the Premier League club, what were your thoughts on what that actually was?
Mark Fishkin: “I had a connection to the CMO of Major League Soccer at the time. I remember grabbing a coffee with him and he spilt the beans to me about the name, New York City Football Club. It didn’t resonate for me at all. It was very generic and I think the connection to the Man City owners, not withstanding, the challenge with both teams is that we live in one of the financial capitals of the world. London, Dubai, Hong Kong, a cosmopolitan city with tons and tons of money interests, you’d think a local guy, a college soccer alum or some hedge fund guy that loves the international game that wants a team to represent the city.
“I believe the guys that are doing the marketing at NYCFC now are really into making it the city’s team with the pigeon and the local courts they do a lot of community stuff. And obviously the new stadium is going to be amazing. There’s a bit of me that’s a little sad that another global football conglomerate owns a team in this market. As much as both teams try really hard, and I think the Red Bulls have also tried to be a community-based team, at times it can be inauthentic.”
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Mark Fishkin can be heard on the Seeing Red podcast all season covering the New York Red Bulls with interviews from players, coaches and other journalists. As the longest running podcasts about any MLS team, Mark’s perspective heading into the Hudson River Derby is one that cannot be missed.
photo by Matt Kremkau